Subject: Emacs Makes All Computing Simple
From: Harold Ancell
Date: 2/8/1996, 8:54 PM
To: fanfic@andrew.cais.com
Reply-to:
hga@acm.org

While it really stands for Editor MACroS (it's first incarnation
was as a set of ITS TECO macros), the subject line is my favorite
alternative (and self-referential) version.

Some other favorites:

Eine Is Not Emacs (the first Lisp Machine emacs)
Zwei Was Eine Originally (the second)

Anyway, here's some bundled replies:

   Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 10:56:06 -0800 (PST)
   From: Nagisa Kanou <nagisa@primenet.com>

   On Thu, 8 Feb 1996, Nagisa Kanou wrote:

   > Hear hear!!
   > Down with emacs and vi!! 
   > Go with the holy power of PICO. ^_^

   Hmm... actually, after listening/reading some other followup comments on 
   emacs and it's "abilities", I take back what I said. 

   But I still prefer the simplicity of pico over the complexities of the 
   other two. ^_^

Which is better, a hammer or a screwdriver?  It depends on what you
want to do.  E.g. I don't use emacs and TeX anymore for my basic word
processing (although I do use emacs for long first drafts).

   Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 12:28:03 -0700
   From: wbaird@NMSU.Edu ()

   nonononono.  Screw elm.  Screw pine.

   UNIX mail forever!

Emacs does this too!  I'm using emacs RMAIL mode to read and comment
on these messages.

   Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 18:02:57 -0500 (EST)
   From: "David C. Yi" <ranmakun@welchlink.welch.jhu.edu>

   On Thu, 8 Feb 1996, Nagisa Kanou wrote:
   > On Wed, 7 Feb 1996 beaubienrd@mala.bc.ca wrote:
   > 
   > Go with the holy power of PICO. ^_^
   > 
   > hehe...
   > 
   > Wing. [pico pico pico pico pico]

   I like pico too!  vi and emac makes me wonder why people want things so 
   obfuscated.  Kinda like what win95 did to the ibm :)

Emacs is big and complicated because it's intended to solve a lot of
complicated problems (and because (except for the original and maybe
Epsilon) all successful varients have used Lisp for an extension
language, and taken advantage of the "Lisp is a ball of mud"
properties of Lisp).  Will pico properly indent your C, Lisp, C++,
Prolog, Fortran, etc. etc. code and help inform you of errors?  Does
it thave an abbreviation feature?  Can it edit ASCII pictures?  Can
you write extensions for it (without getting the source and compiling
a new version)?  Can you edit two or more file with it at once?  Can
you fire off a compliation, have it collect the errors, and have it
run you through each error, placing you at the location of the error
(*** even after you start modifying your buffer and adding or deleting
lines *** (I don't know of any other system that gets this right)).

Is it easier to use than Emacs, at least initially?  I gather so, and
therefore it has got its niche.

   If we spam, lets get some more anime content in it at least.

I'd say that discussing editors is not entirely off topic for a
writing mailling list....  And this thread inspired a fanfic.

   Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 15:41:09 -0800 (PST)
   From: Jeremy Blackman <ranma@eskimo.com>

   On Thu, 8 Feb 1996, David C. Yi wrote:

   > On Thu, 8 Feb 1996, Nagisa Kanou wrote:
   > I like pico too!  vi and emac makes me wonder why people want things so 
   > obfuscated.  Kinda like what win95 did to the ibm :)
   > If we spam, lets get some more anime content in it at least.

   Yes, before you ask...I use Pico, and tin, personally.  Though on my home 
   system I use Xemacs for programming stuff. :)  I just hate any text 
   editor where on half the systems, the help command maps to the backspace 
   key.  (That was a really dumb default for Emacs)

This was without a doubt the second dumbest thing Richard Stallman did
with GNU Emacs.  Let me assure you no other emacs before the gnu
version had this "feature."

(The dumbest thing he did was to use someone else's copyrighted code
as the base; if the company that James Gosling (now of Java fame)
licensed it to (UniPress Software) wasn't run by nice people, RMS and
the other contributers would have lost man years of work after losing
a copyright infringement suit....  (Disclaimer---I used to work for
UniPress.)

   Very Hastily Written Excuses For Fanfics
   presents....

Heh, this discussion had some direct fanfic utility after all :-)

   "I doubt it.  Saotome, why do you not use 'tin' instead of 'nn'?  It has 
   much more power...the power to organize messages into groups, the power 
   to be reconfigured as you desire..."

Figures Kuno would use tin rather than trn....

   Date: Thu, 08 Feb 1996 12:45:37 -0800 (PST)
   From: beaubienrd@mala.bc.ca

   Pointless question number 3 : I need a good ftp site for unix utlitles , 
   does anyone know where one is ? Also I need an ftp site with gnuzip , 
   perferably not compressed.

ftp.uu.net is a good start, and they have gnuzip along with all the
other GNU unix utilities.

					- Harold